Paul Newman

[tiredmom959]

Nova ... that's my point exactly when I started this whole thread ... there is no way to reach adulthood without having willingly done something that isn't 100% healthy for your health and well-being.

I'm not a non-drinker, but think of all the negative things that happen due to alcohol consumption alone ...

[Welthy]

Amen Nova and I agree TiredMom!! I'm glad you wrote that, because I also never smoked around my husband while he was ill or for about 17 years before he was diagnosed. I smoked outside for that period of years and trust me, that's no easy feat near Chicago in the winter. I thought that statement jumped the shark just a tad. Face it, an extensive SCLC diagnosis and most Stage IV NSCLC diagnoses are death sentences for most, whether it is PC to admit it or not. Let's lower those guns friends.

I also question some of the sweeping generalities in statement #3. Granted, I'm a bit out of the cutting edge research loop since my husband died, but I thought that studies during the time he was ill only showed some decrease in effectiveness for patients undergoing treatment for SCLC who continued to smoke and that didn't include all treatments. Maybe newer studies show different. Interesting topic, but would like to see clarification.

Interesting to see this topic and how it comes up in cycles. Having been a viewer of this board since April of 2005, I've watched people come and go and this always has been a hot topic issue each time it is raised.

[Welthy]

Thus my original post Katie, which contained the following, but apparently needs reiteration:

"Welthy"

Bottom line? Post-diagnosis, it doesn't matter. You're all lung cancer patients. Divisiveness and a lack of understanding within the LC community does nothing to advance awareness for our cause. This community is comprised of never smokers, former smokers, and current smokers. You are a part of the LC community regardless of your smoking status. In light of that, I find some of your comments very disheartening.

[CaroleHammett]

Carole: If you're a caregiver to a lung cancer patient and you smoke around them, you might as well stop the caregiving, buy a gun and shoot them because you're killing them".

Nova: To say that if my husband was exposed to cigarette smoke by other's, (which he wasn't, but he kept smoking himself), that I should just get a gun and shoot him, is a little much, don't you think?

Nova: You misunderstood me. I wrote that (1) if HE continued smoking, then there was no sense in HIM undergoing chemo (because it exacerbates the cancer); and (2) that if his caregiver continued to smoke AROUND HIM, then the caregiver might as well shoot him.

You, on the other hand, wrote that "When I smoke, I do it outside, away from everyone. I'm not rude, nor am I selfish to the feelings of others." You also wrote that Harry continued smoking, in which case it didn't matter what you did and, in fact, it probably made him feel better that you were travelling that road together.

As to Harry's having SCLC, quite frankly, if I'd had SCLC instead of NSCLC, or had my expected "expiration date" been sooner I can't guarantee that I, wouldn't have made the decision to keep smoking, too.

In fact (and boy am I going to get flack over this one! ), I have what I call my "Two Week Wish List," which is a list of things I plan to do once I'm down to the wire (last two weeks), and at the top of that list is: I'M GOING TO START SMOKING AGAIN!

Mind you, there are other things on that list as well. In fact, I'm not sure where to start, but how about marijuana, cocaine, Bailey's by the bottle and wine by the case? And then there's my brother's homemade blueberry jelly by the jar and his wife's chocolate fudge by the box (I've been avoiding sugar since my dx).

Other people want to sky dive or hang glide. Not me! I'm going for total decadence, and I'm planning on chain smoking my way through it!

Carole

PS I tried both marijuana and cocaine during the 60s when I was in college. The marijuana made me mellow, not exactly an attractive prospect for a type A personality; whereas the cocaine made me a type A+, which was the last thing I needed; ergo, I dropped them both. Now, however, for my last two weeks, both those prospects sound attractive (although probably not concurrently), so what the Hey!

[CaroleHammett]

Carole: One of the things I love about this site is the lack of "judgmentalism" regarding smoking (who needs that on top of everything else!).

My apologies to all for having gone off in a half dozen different directions on this thread , which started out being about the fact that we're all in the same boat, regardless of how we happened to jump into it.

Carole

[Isunique]

No apologies are needed (at least for me). It is refreshing to see and be able to engage in a spirited discussion about the subject. You are very right about the fact that we are all in the same boat... No one ever deserves any "kind" of cancer, ever.......

It is something we all have to deal with one way or the other.

[shellit74]

replied once early on and have been sitting back and watching/reading... People are doing what this board is intended for... venting their feelings!!! No alpogy need here!

[Dave]

been in enough trouble..glad I stayed outta this one.

[RandyW]

Now the funny Part is Paul newman may not even have Lung cancer!!!!

[blaze100]

Maybe we could make a public service commercial with three lc survivors doing a brief introduction like -

Hi, I'm _______. I smoked for 40 years and I have LC.

Hi, I'm _______, I smoked for two years 40 years ago and I have LC.

Hi, I'm _______, I never smoked and I have LC.

If you have these symptoms;______,_____,_____ ask your doctor for a chest x-ray...... NOBODY DESERVES LUNG CANCER

If we use our most photogenic survivors it could be good. I wonder if American Lung Association would sponsor it? Or maybe, maybe the Paul Newman foundation?

Now that being said, I am absolutely compelled to comment again - even though I know I shouldn't - When I was diagnosed I did anything and everything I could to improve my odds of survival even just 1%. (I still do.) I didn't care it if was proven or unproven, if my one of my doctors told me that he thought eating horse poop might help, I would be eating horse poop every night before bed.

I understand that some people just can't quit smoking. I feel sorry for them. But that does not give them the right to sabotage my efforts to survive. If they smoke where they are supposed to then I can go around them. But when they smoke immediately outside doorways and that smoke drifts into the buildings, then I get upset. I'm supposed to say, "OH well, they are addicted so it's OK. It's not that bad....." Pleeeeze.

Diesel trucks and coal plants aren't asking for sympathy and funds to help fight LC. LC survivors need the non-smoking public's support, but it will be hard to earn when the non-smoking public is sick of inhaling cigarette fumes.

We will never be able to argue that smoking doesn't cause most LC. Smokers are 20 times more likely to get LC. The last surgeon general report stated that there is "no safe level of exposure" to second hand smoke.

I could go on and on with stories about my encounters with smokers over my vacation this summer but it would only make me more upset.

Barb

[tiredmom959]

I see your point, and don't like even walking by someone smoking, especially if my kids are with me. But if I'm honest with myself, I certainly do not do everything else in my power for myself or my kids to ensure they do nothing, eat nothing, participate in nothing that isn't 100% healthy and safe. I certainly do my best, probably even more than the average parent (I'm always told I'm over-protective). But do I let them eat fast food every once in a while? Sure. Am I the ideal weight with a perfect BMI? Heck no! Do I refuse to put anything in my mouth -- or let them -- that isn't 100% perfect for my body and 100% proven-carcinogen free? Who could.

I would never sit in a smoke filled room for even a few minutes and probably wouldn't want my kids to even enter it. But I think if you take normal and reasonable precautions, isn't that enough? Do I have to worry if my kids pass someone on the street and they happen to be smoking?

[RandyW]

Now to get away from Smokers non smokers;

Smoking is the main cause of lung cancer, said Pope.

But breathing very polluted air long-term can raise the risk of lung cancer as much as breathing second-hand smoke, he added.

The largest effect of bad air on deaths from heart disease and lung cancer was on non-smokers. And, bad air increased all study participants' chance of death by the same amount as if they were all “moderately" overweight, the report noted.

From the American Cancer Society!

Also

The study found there was no level of air pollution that was safe, and that the more air pollution increased, the higher the risk became of dying from lung cancer, heart disease, or from any cause.

Pollution drove up the risk of dying from lung cancer the most, followed by risk of death from heart disease, and then by risk of dying from all causes.

The risk of lung cancer death went up by 8% for every 10 micrograms of fine particles in a cubic meter (about 3 feet by 3 feet) of air, the study found. Heart disease deaths went up 6%, and deaths from all causes 4%, for every such increase.

A 1994 study by Pope estimated 50,000 to 100,000 Americans died yearly from the effects of outdoor particulate air pollution.

[Joe B]

This should make you smile

Finally the right kind of press....

http://www.zwire.com/site/index.cfm?newsid=19830578&BRD=2524&PAG=461&dept_id=494488&rfi=8

Joe B

[Welthy]

Joe -- news coverage -- especially someone we " know", always makes me smile. :D

Congrats and thanks for posting. Much continued success.

Welthy

[RandyW]

Kudos Joe and THanks For sharing that with us!!

[barbvh]

Joe,

What a nice story about you and your family. Thanks for sharing!

BTW - you and my son had the same neurosurgeon. Dr. Rosenblum is a great surgeon. Todd had surgery 1/16/06 and then agressive treatment through Henry Ford. Though he developed seizure again a few months ago, it is not from tumor. His scans are still stable.

[lilyjohn]

That old stigma is the reason some people wait too long to see a doctor. How many times have we heard someone say that their doctors wouldn' perform even the simplist test because they didn't or had never smoked? It all goes back to that same old deadly attitude.

Once they made a connection between smoking and LC they quit looking for any other reason. They sit up on their high horses and blame the patient instead of their own lack of determination to find ALL of the reasons. There are other reasons and it really p****s me off that they let that idea go so far. They want to make people ashamed that they smoked and then sentence them to a life of fear and even death just because they can't admit that they fall short in research.

There are so many things out there that could be responsible but no one bothers to try and find out if they are. We llive in a workd that is poluted by everything. I can just imagine standing on a corner outside and having a bus or one of the big trucks or pickup trucks pass blowing off black smoke and someone worried about some one with one little puff of smoke from a cigaret getting too close. Give me a break

I go to the local Safeway and they are collecting to help with Prostrate Cancer research or Breast Cancer researcjh. No one asks them "what they did to deserve it". All cancer sucks and no one deserves it but what they deserve even less is that narrow minded attitude especially when it comes from doctors or those who really could make a difference if they just tried. I have even asked again and again why they don't collect for LC. No one seems able to give me an answer

I smoked for 43 years and quit just over 2 years ago. When I started no one told me that they were bad for me. Just like no one tells the kids that the stuff they put in their stomachs may someday cause them harm. Quitting was one of the hardest things I have ever done, but unlike many exsmokers I don't like to act holier than thou toward those who do still smoke. Nothing anyone said made me quit. When it was time I knew and I did it and I am very proud that I did. That doesn't give me the right to set in judgement of anyone who is still addicted to them.

I guess I want to tell people that the next time they take a bite of their favorite food they should stop and think about it. Some day they may get sick and I can't help but wonder how they would feel if someone told them that it was their own fault or that they deserved it because of something they ate.

What is wrong with this world anyway? I just can't bellieve how insinsitive people can be.